Reality Check - What is your opinion

Posted by juji (470 days ago)

Hi Everyone,

I have been speaking to people about the issue of marrige/relationships. I am new to Hong Kong and recently started dating someone. I have had several people ask me "is he the one"? to which I reply "no I don't think so". They then say things like: "you're over 30 you shouldn't waste your time", "you shouldn't go away with him, you'll find it harder to break up with him and you don't have time to waste". "You don't want to end up 35 and still single after wasting a few years on this guy".

I like the guy and don't feel like breaking up with him. I don't think I want to marry him but I don't want to break up with him.
I'm not sure whether there is merit in what these people are saying.
Is this something peculiar to Hong Kong? I've never had people say things like this to me before.

My question is.. do you think they are right? Should I be searching for the person I have in my mind that I want to marry or should I go with the present relationship and risk being single in a few years.

Just want a reality check, preferably from people with more experience in these matters than I have.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Find what you are after in our Bangkok A-Z Directory

Posted by janniehk (470 days ago)

HI
I had an experience like yours and ended up staying with a guy that I didnt' feel was the right one. You should think about moving on and dating other people b/c once you have time and emotions invested into a relationship it may be harder to break up down the road.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Peet (470 days ago)

Hi Juji,

I think that you're experiencing one of the differences between the Western and Eastern cultures. When I am back in my home country, people rarely ask me if I am married. However, in Asia, people constantly ask me if I am married. When I tell them that I am not, they are surprised and tell me that I should get married soon if I want to have a family (I'm in my mid-30's). It's a completely different mindset - not better or worse, just different.

My experience has been that there is more societal pressure on women than men to marry before 30 in Asia, as people feel that a woman should be married and with kids by 30 (early 30's at the latest), and divorce is still frowned upon (though this slowly seems to be changing). Asian culture is more traditional than Western culture in this way.

In Japan, a woman unmarried by 25 is dismissed by some as "Christmas cake" — thrown out on Dec. 26th. The adage goes that after the age of 25, women start to discount their "Christmas cake" until they are almost willing to give it away by age 30. Again, this is changing. There are increasing numbers of career women who refuse to marry since they say they cannot find guys who will allow them to have both a career and a family, but this still seems to be the minority.

I have an Asian gf and I often get pressure to marry not only from her family but from her friends as well. They feel that dating for a long period of time (and again, "a long period of time" differs in the Western and Eastern cultures) without plans for marriage is disingenuous and that I am perhaps squandering other opportunities that she may have for marriage. I just feel that we haven't been dating long enough to make such a monumental decision.

As women in Asia reach the age of 30 and beyond, it seems that many enter a dating relationship, first and foremost, as a potential for future marriage. I suppose this has a lot to do with their biological clocks. In the west, where women face less societal pressure to marry by 30, women seem to have more time to consider marriage and so perhaps fewer approach each dating relationship as a precursor to marriage.

Again, it's just a different approach to dating and marriage. The best advice I can give you is to try to adjust to the "marriage" questions/concerns and see it for what it is - a culture difference - as opposed to an assault on your character, which is not what is intended. Lastly, if you feel that you want to marry into the Asian culture, statistically your chances will probably decrease as you approach 40. If not, then I'd say enjoy your time in HK and see where it leads you.

As long as you have been honest with your bf and told him that marriage is not in your plans at the present moment (if marriage is even an appropriate topic at this point in your relationship) then it's up to him to decide whether this is the right relationship for him.

(I am based in Tokyo)

Posted by zionmainframe (470 days ago)

I'm not trying to generalize, but if the person that you spoken to is local Chinese lady. Their ultimate goal is to get married before 30 and have kids.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Mobile.Fidelity (470 days ago)

zion, your generalization, doesnt seem all that effective. Hong Kong has a very large percentage of unmarried women in the 30 - 45 age group. 40% of Hong Kong marriages last year were to women from mainland China, from what I am told, it's because of expectational standard related issues.

Women in Hong Kong won't just marry you to have a family unless you are financially able to afford it. No real suprize when you consider the extremely high cost of schooling etc.

Those who cannot find a suitable man, deal with it and just remain single, it's a reality of Hong Kong.

I remember reading in the SCMP that for every single man, there are 3 single women in Hong Kong, which indicates that women in Hong Kong maintain an exacting standard as to what they want, they are most unwilling to lower their expectation, and would rather remain single than to waste time with someone lesser than their ideal.

I agree with the original topic poster, I've been asked if I was married many times, even though I live with my long term fiancee, they look really suprized when I explain that we live together and own an apartment together.

Later this year, our answer to the " are you married" question will be yes, not that I think it will make any difference, but do agree that most people in the west rarely ask you about your marital status.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by juji (470 days ago)

Hi Everyone, Thank you for your responses, particularly peet.Everything you say is valid, however I am not talking about the chinese population, and its not just one woman that has said this to me. It was two western women and one western man.

The reason I have not been married up until now is not because I havent had the opportunity, I've had wonderful boyfriends in my twenties and most/all of them have wanted to take the next step after a year and a half or so but I simply wasn't ready. If felt I was too young.

I had made up my mind that I wouldn't get married before I was thirty. Now here I am at thirty thinking marriage would be good and people are telling me that I can't waste my time.

The thing is, a guy could be perfectly charming, well mannered and polite for the first six or eight months and then you might find the real person, underneath the fascade is a cheat,or a moron, or bigoted, or might hate woman or even worse himself.

So of course you have to be in a relationship with someone for long enough to get to know them, for them to let their guard down and show their true colours to work out whether that person is the 'one'.

At the moment I don't think this guy is the guy I want to marry but that may change. I just wanted a reality check to see if the people who are urging me not to 'waste my time' are bonkers or are they just making sense?

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by ldavy (470 days ago)

Hi Juji,
I don't think they're making sense at all. You like the guy, so carry on seeing him for as long as you want to! You might decide you do want to marry him later on, but if not, so what? At least you'll have had fun and enjoyed the relationship. If you break up with him because you don't think you want to marry him, you might not meet anyone else who you DO want to marry anyway so what's the point?

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by tia (470 days ago)

juji: If you like him and want to give it a go, do so. If he's not the one, at some point, it will become apparent. If he is the one, you'll know it as well.

Getting married after 30 is not a myth. It happens. I did it. I met my husband when I was 32. Did I know from first sight/date/month he was 'the one'? Nope. Didn't matter. I liked being with him and we got along well.

Are these people bonkers? No....they just have a different take on life/marriage/relationships than you do.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by juji (470 days ago)

I guess, on some level, I am also scared that they are right. However, I can't live my life in a mercenary way as if I'm interviewing a candidate. However, on the same hand I also don't want to waste my own time. Thanks for your words Tia, I think I'm the type of person who decides once I truly know someone whether I like them or not.

Tia, are you the same person who got a 20 pack of RVD's from your boyfriend some time back? If so congratulations for getting married. I hope your latter birthday presents were more to your liking.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by tia (470 days ago)

Infamous for that, am I? ;-)

Yeah...that was me....and that's the guy I married too! :)

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Pupalicious (470 days ago)

What's an RVD?

I'm white, and my bf is Chinese (as I've said many times hahahaha) and his Chinese friends are constantly asking me when we're having a baby and when we're getting married. I tell them to ask him, it's funny watching him squirm.

I genuinely would shudder to get married before 29/30-ish. I think being a young bride is so trashy. My best friend (I love him to bits) got married when he was 19 and could only afford to hold his reception in a pub! He's a fantastic single father of 2 now, and he's a great guy. But I just think it's such a waste of life to get married young.

Don't listen to what anyone else says! Just follow your heart. They're a bit different (odd?) in this part of the world, and seem to think you should get married early. My friends are only in their mid 20's and they're talking about marriage with their boyfriends. Seems nightmare-ish to me, but each to their own!

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by tia (470 days ago)

She means DVD-Rs.

http://hongkong.asiaxpat.com/forums/relationships/threads/73136.asp

Most people I know are getting or were married fairly late in life. One of my best school friends got married at 23 and is still happily married. Times, they are a changin'. Young/old...I don't think it matter WHEN it happens, so long as when it happens, YOU are happy with the person you have chosen to spend your life with.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by skipping (470 days ago)

To me, 30 is not the time line to get married. You still have a long way to go. You'll simply regret for getting married with someone that you don't love that much.

You mentioned that you are new to HK, things may not be settled as yet. Enjoy your time, follow your feeling. You don't have to break up with the guy right now. U might like to spend some mroe time together, however remeber to leave space for both of you.

I believe that marriage originates from true love, not from the urge to get married. I've been married for 13 years, I do adore people having the freedom of being single.

good luck.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Peet (469 days ago)

Hi Juji,

These were Western guys and girls that asked you about marriage? Well, I guess that blows my premise to hell! :)

I can only agree with the others and say that each person has to decide for themselves when it's the right time to marry. Obviously your friends have a different time frame in mind for themselves, but that's fine for them. I'd tell you to just enjoy your time with this guy, take things at a pace that is comfortable for you, and see what develops. I think that you'll know in time whether he is the right guy. If not, you're still young and there are plenty of other guys out there.

(I am based in Tokyo)

Posted by Pumpkin (469 days ago)

Hong Kong is in a timewarp..you wake up today aged 30...and tomorrow you are 35. Times flies here..and the serious dating pool is small. Aged 30, you have some time to mess around..aged 35, not so much...to the point where if you want a serious relationship in your life, you start seriously considering leaving this place.

For now I reckon enjoy...but don't hang around with him 'just because'. If he's not 'the one', keep your eyes open.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by thingumy (469 days ago)

well said Pumkin about the timewarp , the truth is even if he is 'the one', the way hormones work makes it not impossible that another 'the one' wont pass by your window anyway. Perspectives change with age , and that goes for fidelity , husbands , wives , girlfriends , colleagues , and your perceptoin of your self and what you like or dislike. Enjoy him while you can , what were the lyrics to that song ? "any love is good love , so i took what i could get ... you aint seen nothing yet!"

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by justin credulous (469 days ago)

exactly, if he's not the one and you dont think he will become the one anytime soon...why are you with him? "passing time until something better comes along"? thats not cool. better than being alone? also not cool...these things are oki when you are in your 20's, but like Pumpkin says, time whizzes by out here...that said, I dont think moving to another country will solve your man problems...I dont know anyone who has moved back to wherever and somehow lucked out in the dating game...

(I am based in Iraq)

Posted by thingumy (469 days ago)

well , now you mention it, justin. Has anyone in this forum ever 'lucked out' dating and thats the end of story, here or back overseas?. Maybe this forum is just chocker with juji type clones forever looking for a quick emotional fix but doomed to trawl internet forumns for the rest of eternity on the vague promise of "the one" being out there. lol ...cheerfull image painted for you there.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by tia (469 days ago)

Sure...people luck out all the time...they just never post the happy stories because it's not good discussion fodder!

I *lucked out* on a vacation. It can happen.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by justin credulous (469 days ago)

Indeed :o) trumpeting happiness from the rooftops doesnt make everyone want to join in.

(I am based in Iraq)

Posted by My Hong Kong (469 days ago)

I lucked out on a dating site, but hell...it took 2 years and meeting about 30 people and seeing them not only one time! It feels good to be off the dating site...I started to hate going there...but I feel grateful too. :)

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by Meiguoren (469 days ago)

Oh Tia, I remember that post! ;-)

As for the dating issue, juji, there really is a biological clock, and I think that's the only reason to have any concern at all. If you don't have a burning desire to have biological babies, then there's no pressure biologically to chase into a marriage type relationship. If you would feel your life as you know it would be incomplete without a baby, then you have to think about what the options are IF you don't find "Mr. Right" before the biological clock runs out. Would you adopt, be a single parent, just decide to be a great "auntie" to someone? Or would your heart be broken if you couldn't have a "little Juji" with the same color eyes as you and her daddy? I've known friends of all sorts, who felt all kinds of ways, there's no right or wrong about that leaning. You just have to make decisions you'll be comfortable with when you're fifty years old and hopefully look back with no regrets. But IMO babies are the only reason to think about timing. My own infertility doctor told me that fertility takes a steep dive after age 36, and you also have to think about what it means to be an older parent -- to be teaching a child how to ride a bike at age 50 when many people are enjoying grandchildren -- but it's not unheard of to have a first baby at age 40+ anymore. I'd say just do what you're comfortable with!

(I am based in Guangzhou)

Posted by BMW 330i (469 days ago)

Relationship is not like buying a car. Don't like it sell and buy another. Take your time to ensure he is Mr. Right for you. Do not let anyone pressure you by reminding of your age as marriage is not something to be taken lightly like those Hollywoods clowns. I dated for 5 years before marrying as I know deep down inside she is right for me and now I am happily married with 2 wonderful boys.
.
Sometime it is good to date a little longer as the true colour of your partner tend to show her/his dark side nature :)

(I am based in Unspecified)

Posted by juji (469 days ago)

I think it is a tricky issue. The whole time/vs age thing. Yes I probably would want to be in a position where I had a choice of whether to have a child or not, at time flys fast everywhere as they say.

I'm not with the guy to bide my time, or because I don't like being single. I love being single. I like being with this guy more. I'm in a relationship with him becuase I like him.

The weird thing is that friends (westerners) are asking me - after two months - is he the one? I don't think so but how can you tell. I think it would take a year and half at least to get to know the person and then what if you don't like it? You spend another year and a half with someone else who you don't marry and before you know it you're 38 and single!!!

What a frightening prospect. Of course, much less frightening than being married to someone you shouldn't be but it just means that your biological clock is ticking and you might miss out on those choices. Not a position I want to be in.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by justin credulous (469 days ago)

Unfortunately, thats how it goes. Are you the kind of person who believes the grass is greener on the other side? I have a friend like that...nearing 40 and still single...and he always says "Hey, you remember that time when you said I would never be satisfied with things in life? Man, you were right" and he knows what the deal is, and yes, sometimes he's lonely...he keeps making plans to settle down, to stop working so hard, to stop travelling as much...and time keeps marching on. Time waits for no one. There is no perfect man or perfect woman, when you get to that level of realisation, it becomes easier. You learn to appreciate the real person in front of you, flaws and good bits, and your heart knows when you decide you dont want to look any further.

The fact of the matter is that a womans fertility begins to decline by 27 and a man's fertility too (even though they dont think it) begins to decline by 35...with any one attempt at prime time spermination there is a 20-30% chance of conceiving...so yeah, you do the math...

(I am based in Iraq)

Posted by My Hong Kong (469 days ago)

juji...you are with the guy because you like him, but you don't think he is the one. In what sense he is not the one? You feel that you like him but you don't love him? Or are there other factors?

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by juji (468 days ago)

Hi MHK,

Yes it might sound confusing. I have actually never been serious about the whole marriage thing.. believing for one reason or another that it wasn't right for me, age or location, it's state of mind I guess.
THere was once that I dated a guy for one to two months that I thought he was the one... when I really got to know what type of narsisistic player he was I couldn't believe how wrong I was. I have spoken to people who said that they knew as soon as they met one another that they were 'the one'. I've never thought like this. I would like to get to know someone first.
So, I get along with this guy, he is witty, has a great sense of humor, good looking, I'm ridiculously attracted to him, I also think hes a good guy. But I wouldn't make a decision that I wanted to marry someone based on knowing them for two months.. it's a bit of a ridiculous thing for me to consider.

(I am based in Hong Kong)

Posted by selda (468 days ago)

marriage is overrated...so just enjoy time with him and don't worry about settling or not settling down.
If the relationship has got steam...you might still be together in 10 years time, if not, you will be bonking someone else, which will feel good at that time.

As to fertility etc. ask yourself if you really want to have kids...not everybody is wired that way. And if so, would you want to have his kids?
kids are forever...a partner might play a smaller role in your life. I have so many friends with kids who are happy to be parents but have since changed partner.
Since divorce became an easy option, the only family you can count on are those you have blood-ties with, be it parents, siblings or children. Partners come and go...at least according to the stats.

(I am based in Unspecified)

Posted by justin credulous (468 days ago)

The whole "the one" bs is also overrated. In life there are more than one "the ones" and anyone who tells you that phnaar phnaar story about how the man they are with is "the one" simply didnt have the good fortune or the memory to have more than one "the one". A lot of peeps go into something with guards up, but those who are happy to love without any hangups are privvy to more than one "the one" and they know if one "the one" goes up s**t creek without a paddle...there will always be another "the one" and so they dont despair. They dont spend their time constantly comparing this relationship or this partner with the past, each experience is unique and deserves the same enthusiastic attention as the last.

Women get told this whole "the one" story along with the "three date" rule or the "you call me, not I call you" thang...its all a bunch of hocus pocus and as soon as you realise that this bunch of unrealistic expectations have been spoon fed to you by the media and your grandma (who, lets face it, did she REALLY have a happy marriage?) the closer you are to free.

My boss cracks this joke saying "If you find your standards are too high, lower them"! I dont agree with that for anything more than a laugh, but I have to say after reading this MSN story yesterday about short guys and their dating problems...and tall girls and their dating woes...you start to realise saying "Need man to be 6'2+" isnt exactly anything more than a superficial bunch of rubbish...Figure out what will make you happy and find someone who is willing to be or do that for you, it really is that simple. Making them happy in the process should be a rewarding experience and not a chore...thats all it takes to be or have "the one". Life is about give and take, its about karma. If you dont give as good as you get, you will lose "the one". If you dont get as good as you give, thats grounds for kicking one "the one" to the curb and finding you a replacement "the one".

(I am based in Iraq)

Posted by thingumy (468 days ago)

well said again justin , the fact is there is no "the one" and people are cheated out of love my gimicks and cheap marketing. Imagine you have a terrible accident tomorow or a doctor says you have a terminal disease , can you calculate how many days you could have been in the arms of another person , in love and happy that you shared your mind and body with that person , instead of searching for 'the one' and never finding him or her. Time waits for no one.

(I am based in Hong Kong)